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sathorI feel very confused.
As I've obtained more knowledge, I've only further convoluted my sense of self, my senses of reality, and my reflection on it.
A primary example is how I comprehend that my perception of things as they are is not necessarily the same as what those things are in actuality. In fact, this apprehension of my own subjectivity is, more or less, an absolute destroyer of confidence and an annihilator of my will...what is left of it, at any rate.
However, I also recognize that all other people, even with my limited understanding of them, must experience the same - even if they can not recognize it as viscerally as I can.
I begin to wonder if maybe, at some point, I began on a path of divergence from what is normal. My brain - my reality interface - therefore developed its own ways of interpreting and experiencing, reflecting, communicating as well...and these were divergent from the normal, too. Eventually, I became so drastically different from other people that it's quite literally as though I reside in some alternate reality - my world is not your world. I can interact with you, but it will not be the same as your interactions with others. I feel as though my very "frequency" is different, the very nature of my being is different. One might at this point consider the possibility that I suffer from some sort of psychological ailment - and maybe, I do - or, maybe, it is only a psychological illness insofar as things are concerned in your world - in my world, it makes not a bit of difference whether I am suffering from one or not. I simply am what I am. I see what I see. I feel what I feel. I could just as easily believe something else, but I would be in conflict with my feelings. Such is the power of belief. We at some point have to come to terms with our beliefs...and our experience of reality. I could believe I was a talented musician, but I have no following and to my ears it falls incredibly short compared to the masters. The same could be said of intellect - my only saving grace in this case is I feel I have tread my inner world much more thoroughly than most.
I am confused. I am confused about what it is that I am to be doing, besides surviving, for no know purpose besides the fact that I can not be sure if death is any less painful and lonely. Certainly I can look to others and see, even if I am comparing their "outsides" to my "insides", that their lives are more complete - that they enjoy much more of their life than I - that they have love and affection - that they are attractive and draw others to them. This brings me to an important point - I have always hated Maslow's Hierarchy. If love and affection is a basic need to self-actualize, I am quite literally doomed. I have sent half a hundred messages if not more to local singles on dating websites, and not a one has responded. Some of them actually had interesting, deep profiles that showed a love for art, music, literature...it is apparent to me that, in my dealings with people, I must be similar to anti-matter. This is not mere chance, lack of luck. The pattern is apparent - and the more negative, or nonexistent feedback I receive from my actions in this life, the more I fall into oblivion, mistrust of humankind, and even misanthropy. I have teetered on the edge of outright hatred of man for a long time...and I've never been alone in this (many philosophers professed similar sentiments) but I am reaching a point at which it becomes simply ludicrous.
The confusion runs deeper, though. It runs into my very fabric. I was raised a Protestant - in fact, I have some pretty terrible memories of church, and the bitch that preached there. I repressed most of those years of my life. I lost more of them when we moved to the middle of nowhere. But I discovered other religions and theology around the age of twelve. I read as much as I could on eastern philosophy and religion...Buddhism, Hinduism...I read occult texts and guides to spiritual enlightenment. I practiced meditation. I experienced very transcendent states of consciousness and being. Science wants me to believe none of that was real, that it's simply biochemical responses to different brain-wave states. So be it. So there's no magick, and there's no God. There's no love either - it's a biochemical reaction, too. Everything we experience, from mental illness to godsmack, is nothing more than a physiological experience of different chemical levels and brain-wave states. At this rate, one might as well admit there's no such thing as ethics or morality, either. We don't kill each other, take want we want, or live in absolute anarchy because a long time ago someone created the social contract and thought up paid law enforcement and prisons. We have all sorts of social norms and laws, and while we preach morality, compassion, love and fairness, we simultaneously treat one-another like competitors...we mistreat the ugly, the weak, the unpopular...we raise up on pedestals the beautiful, the wealthy, the powerful, the lucky. We enslave third world nations. We murder millions. All the while we live like kings of the old days. The worst that could befall you is that you could be homeless, eating out of a shelter, sleeping on wooden planks with a single blanket. Or you could get murdered.
How deep the confusion runs. I wanted to believe that there was magick, and that there was spirituality, and that if I worked hard enough and I tried hard enough, maybe I could overcome all of my issues in life - maybe I could achieve peace in my soul - maybe I could learn to change my circumstances. I haven't learned a thing. Whatever I think I learn, or whatever I think I experience, there's someone else preaching the exact opposite, or worse yet, that it's not even real. I believed that I was attractive, worthwhile once, and yet, my experience in the world has only taught me the opposite. I believed I was good, loving, compassionate once...and yet, as I see the string of mistreatment and unfair handshakes, I can not be so sure any longer.
I look to the people whom the world puts on pedestals, even at the lowest levels - my own employer and it's hierarchy, for instance - and I wonder to myself if life was never about education...it was never about love and compassion...it was never about God and spirituality...it was never about respecting your parents and your peers. It was about being popular. Popularity is everything. It's as if life played a cruel joke on me. I was lied to about the nature of humanity.
I really wish I could leave this world behind, and find a place where the ideals were real. Where love was in abundance. Where people weren't mistreated for being different, or unusual...but celebrated for their unique expression of their genetics and experience. I'm not sure I even have the strength or the will left anymore to go looking...and to be frankly honest...I don't really think there's a place like that anyway.
Treat others how you want to be treated...if only that really resulted in people treating you the way you treat them.
Maybe Satan really is a good explanation of all the horse shit on this planet.
-----
It is a difficult thing for me to say, but I am starting to recognize that the idealistic perception I had of myself when I was younger was probably the best thing I ever had...it was probably one of my best traits. And slowly, my experience of the world has eroded that away to nothingness. I will grant that I am well above average intelligence...albeit with no specific focus or discipline, thus I can not speak at length about any particular topic or area of expertise...but besides that, I am one of the worst human beings on the planet. I am non-violent, but I am judgmental. I am compassionate, but I hardly ever find myself helping anyone. I am loving, but the lack of other traits prevents me from loving anyone, as they would not want to come near. I am quiet, and shy - I don't like large gatherings of people, and I often don't talk to strangers, especially at any length. I avoid the public as much as humanly possible. I hardly ever initiate contact with a stranger. I spend a lot of time on music and writing, but nothing of note has ever come out of it...and most of the time, I feel like I'm banging my head against a brick wall...as though I lack some very important knowledge about HOW to go about being a musician, how to go about even LEARNING music, to IMPROVE. The same could be said about writing, although I feel as I've gotten older, my ability to stay focused and on topic...once again, to speak at any length...has gotten more difficult. My mind feels more fragmented than it ever did as a teenager - although, I feel as if my life and my feelings were much simpler then...there was much less confusion. I knew who I was, or rather, I didn't know who I was and so I was whatever I was. Now I have all sorts of opinions about myself that affect me in different ways, and at different levels. My self image has been tainted by knowledge and wisdom, and probably most grievously, philosophy. The great destroyer of self, philosophy. That great annihilator of confidence, philosophy. Once you know that you do not know, you know only that you know nothing.
I am truly a good person at heart, but the world has never received me well. I've never gotten a fair shake. I'm terrible at making new friends and acquaintances, probably because I'm narcissistic and self-absorbed, or maybe it's just because I'm shy and quiet, or maybe it's because I truly fear rejection. That bleeds over into the romantic realm, I'm sure. I was once described as, "a person you could spend a week around and not know a single thing about." Actually, it was describing someone else, but then I noted that, "Oh, that person is like me then" and the rest of the group agreed.
I really do just want to disappear. I want to be someone else. Not me anymore.
It's not like the world would miss the person that I am, after all. I'm just a shadow on the wall to most people. Living a lonely life outside of the cave.
As I've obtained more knowledge, I've only further convoluted my sense of self, my senses of reality, and my reflection on it.
A primary example is how I comprehend that my perception of things as they are is not necessarily the same as what those things are in actuality. In fact, this apprehension of my own subjectivity is, more or less, an absolute destroyer of confidence and an annihilator of my will...what is left of it, at any rate.
However, I also recognize that all other people, even with my limited understanding of them, must experience the same - even if they can not recognize it as viscerally as I can.
I begin to wonder if maybe, at some point, I began on a path of divergence from what is normal. My brain - my reality interface - therefore developed its own ways of interpreting and experiencing, reflecting, communicating as well...and these were divergent from the normal, too. Eventually, I became so drastically different from other people that it's quite literally as though I reside in some alternate reality - my world is not your world. I can interact with you, but it will not be the same as your interactions with others. I feel as though my very "frequency" is different, the very nature of my being is different. One might at this point consider the possibility that I suffer from some sort of psychological ailment - and maybe, I do - or, maybe, it is only a psychological illness insofar as things are concerned in your world - in my world, it makes not a bit of difference whether I am suffering from one or not. I simply am what I am. I see what I see. I feel what I feel. I could just as easily believe something else, but I would be in conflict with my feelings. Such is the power of belief. We at some point have to come to terms with our beliefs...and our experience of reality. I could believe I was a talented musician, but I have no following and to my ears it falls incredibly short compared to the masters. The same could be said of intellect - my only saving grace in this case is I feel I have tread my inner world much more thoroughly than most.
I am confused. I am confused about what it is that I am to be doing, besides surviving, for no know purpose besides the fact that I can not be sure if death is any less painful and lonely. Certainly I can look to others and see, even if I am comparing their "outsides" to my "insides", that their lives are more complete - that they enjoy much more of their life than I - that they have love and affection - that they are attractive and draw others to them. This brings me to an important point - I have always hated Maslow's Hierarchy. If love and affection is a basic need to self-actualize, I am quite literally doomed. I have sent half a hundred messages if not more to local singles on dating websites, and not a one has responded. Some of them actually had interesting, deep profiles that showed a love for art, music, literature...it is apparent to me that, in my dealings with people, I must be similar to anti-matter. This is not mere chance, lack of luck. The pattern is apparent - and the more negative, or nonexistent feedback I receive from my actions in this life, the more I fall into oblivion, mistrust of humankind, and even misanthropy. I have teetered on the edge of outright hatred of man for a long time...and I've never been alone in this (many philosophers professed similar sentiments) but I am reaching a point at which it becomes simply ludicrous.
The confusion runs deeper, though. It runs into my very fabric. I was raised a Protestant - in fact, I have some pretty terrible memories of church, and the bitch that preached there. I repressed most of those years of my life. I lost more of them when we moved to the middle of nowhere. But I discovered other religions and theology around the age of twelve. I read as much as I could on eastern philosophy and religion...Buddhism, Hinduism...I read occult texts and guides to spiritual enlightenment. I practiced meditation. I experienced very transcendent states of consciousness and being. Science wants me to believe none of that was real, that it's simply biochemical responses to different brain-wave states. So be it. So there's no magick, and there's no God. There's no love either - it's a biochemical reaction, too. Everything we experience, from mental illness to godsmack, is nothing more than a physiological experience of different chemical levels and brain-wave states. At this rate, one might as well admit there's no such thing as ethics or morality, either. We don't kill each other, take want we want, or live in absolute anarchy because a long time ago someone created the social contract and thought up paid law enforcement and prisons. We have all sorts of social norms and laws, and while we preach morality, compassion, love and fairness, we simultaneously treat one-another like competitors...we mistreat the ugly, the weak, the unpopular...we raise up on pedestals the beautiful, the wealthy, the powerful, the lucky. We enslave third world nations. We murder millions. All the while we live like kings of the old days. The worst that could befall you is that you could be homeless, eating out of a shelter, sleeping on wooden planks with a single blanket. Or you could get murdered.
How deep the confusion runs. I wanted to believe that there was magick, and that there was spirituality, and that if I worked hard enough and I tried hard enough, maybe I could overcome all of my issues in life - maybe I could achieve peace in my soul - maybe I could learn to change my circumstances. I haven't learned a thing. Whatever I think I learn, or whatever I think I experience, there's someone else preaching the exact opposite, or worse yet, that it's not even real. I believed that I was attractive, worthwhile once, and yet, my experience in the world has only taught me the opposite. I believed I was good, loving, compassionate once...and yet, as I see the string of mistreatment and unfair handshakes, I can not be so sure any longer.
I look to the people whom the world puts on pedestals, even at the lowest levels - my own employer and it's hierarchy, for instance - and I wonder to myself if life was never about education...it was never about love and compassion...it was never about God and spirituality...it was never about respecting your parents and your peers. It was about being popular. Popularity is everything. It's as if life played a cruel joke on me. I was lied to about the nature of humanity.
I really wish I could leave this world behind, and find a place where the ideals were real. Where love was in abundance. Where people weren't mistreated for being different, or unusual...but celebrated for their unique expression of their genetics and experience. I'm not sure I even have the strength or the will left anymore to go looking...and to be frankly honest...I don't really think there's a place like that anyway.
Treat others how you want to be treated...if only that really resulted in people treating you the way you treat them.
Maybe Satan really is a good explanation of all the horse shit on this planet.
-----
It is a difficult thing for me to say, but I am starting to recognize that the idealistic perception I had of myself when I was younger was probably the best thing I ever had...it was probably one of my best traits. And slowly, my experience of the world has eroded that away to nothingness. I will grant that I am well above average intelligence...albeit with no specific focus or discipline, thus I can not speak at length about any particular topic or area of expertise...but besides that, I am one of the worst human beings on the planet. I am non-violent, but I am judgmental. I am compassionate, but I hardly ever find myself helping anyone. I am loving, but the lack of other traits prevents me from loving anyone, as they would not want to come near. I am quiet, and shy - I don't like large gatherings of people, and I often don't talk to strangers, especially at any length. I avoid the public as much as humanly possible. I hardly ever initiate contact with a stranger. I spend a lot of time on music and writing, but nothing of note has ever come out of it...and most of the time, I feel like I'm banging my head against a brick wall...as though I lack some very important knowledge about HOW to go about being a musician, how to go about even LEARNING music, to IMPROVE. The same could be said about writing, although I feel as I've gotten older, my ability to stay focused and on topic...once again, to speak at any length...has gotten more difficult. My mind feels more fragmented than it ever did as a teenager - although, I feel as if my life and my feelings were much simpler then...there was much less confusion. I knew who I was, or rather, I didn't know who I was and so I was whatever I was. Now I have all sorts of opinions about myself that affect me in different ways, and at different levels. My self image has been tainted by knowledge and wisdom, and probably most grievously, philosophy. The great destroyer of self, philosophy. That great annihilator of confidence, philosophy. Once you know that you do not know, you know only that you know nothing.
I am truly a good person at heart, but the world has never received me well. I've never gotten a fair shake. I'm terrible at making new friends and acquaintances, probably because I'm narcissistic and self-absorbed, or maybe it's just because I'm shy and quiet, or maybe it's because I truly fear rejection. That bleeds over into the romantic realm, I'm sure. I was once described as, "a person you could spend a week around and not know a single thing about." Actually, it was describing someone else, but then I noted that, "Oh, that person is like me then" and the rest of the group agreed.
I really do just want to disappear. I want to be someone else. Not me anymore.
It's not like the world would miss the person that I am, after all. I'm just a shadow on the wall to most people. Living a lonely life outside of the cave.
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no subject
Date: 2014-09-14 07:38 am (UTC)"As I've obtained more knowledge, I've only further convoluted my sense of self, my senses of reality, and my reflection on it.".
Yes. That's how it works. Bear up; it's going to continue to get more so, and driving yourself mad over it is not going to make anything better. Do you remember all those (figurative) Big Red Warning Labels about Initiation? Yeah, those. Now you're starting to see the reason for them. Aleister Crowley said "The lunatic asylums are full of people who went seeking for the Extraordinary before they had any real competence at dealing with the Ordinary": don't be one of them. Seriously, just don't.
"In fact, this apprehension of my own subjectivity is, more or less, an absolute destroyer of confidence and an annihilator of my will."
'The centipede was happy quite
Until a frog in fun
Said "Pray, which leg comes after which?"
This raised her mind to such a pitch
She lay distracted in the ditch
Considering how to run.'
... I saw you'd been reading Robert Anton Wilson and Tim Leary. Beware, Will Robinson: they will eat your brain if you let them. Fun as they both are, and avant-garde as they were last century, they are both embarrassingly Not Even Wrong about brain/mind as viewed by 21st-century neuroscience. Which is hardly the Last Word itself, I might add. I recommend you take everything you read of theirs with a large shaker of salt.
Sheesh, now I'm worried you're going to go read Castaneda. You do know Castaneda was writing fiction, yes? Do not forget that crucial fact, if you ever do read him, or he will mess your head up even more than the Illuminatus! trilogy, which is also 100% fiction.
"I feel what I feel. I could just as easily believe something else, but I would be in conflict with my feelings. Such is the power of belief."
Such is the power of irrational belief, to cause you to keep thinking illogical thoughts because they're comfortingly familiar, even though what is familiar about them is that they make you feel bad. C'mon, where's the critical thinking skills?
"I could believe I was a talented musician, but I have no following and to my ears it falls incredibly short compared to the masters. The same could be said of intellect..."
You're not a master musician at this point, no. But on the other hand, you're not yet 30. The fact that you're not a master doesn't mean you aren't a talented musician. You don't have a following because you don't do the things you would have to do to get (and keep) one - that has little to do with 'talent'; it's all about the marketing.
"If love and affection is a basic need to self-actualize, I am quite literally doomed."
Meh, Maslow. Maslow's hierarchy is a useful framework for certain kinds of discussions, NOT a description of how the human psyche actually works. As for "love and affection" - do you see anywhere in there that it says it has to be sexual/romantic love and affection? No, because sex and romance are not essential.
You live with your family, whom you care about, and who care about you. You have friends. Presumably you have pets, or could have if you wanted them. Presumably there are people in your town in need of services, and other people volunteering to provide those services, who would appreciate your help.
True fact: making your mate the Sun of your world - the only source of light and warmth - is a surefire recipe for a miserable life. Alas, when you say you "must be similar to anti-matter", you might be uncomfortably close to the truth: nobody wants to get sucked into a Needy Black Hole of Neediness. What are you doing to give love and affection to others? Hatred of mankind is about the most unattractive and unhealthy attitude a person can adopt, so indulging in that kind of thinking is really shooting yourself in the foot, relationship-wise.
(Too long; continued)
no subject
Date: 2014-09-14 08:45 am (UTC)That being said, how could it be that the lunatic asylums would be full of those people, if there was nothing out there? But that can't really be the case, can it.
When I would read Dion Fortune heavily, I'd find myself seeing patterns and things in the webwork of reality that I didn't see before. If I don't stay brushed up on it, it fades away - but the imprint of experiencing something like that never quite fades away.
Yes, there are many red flags for initiation - my theory on that might be that delving into the deep recesses of the subconscious and unconscious and whatever else isn't the best place for a person that doesn't quite have their life straight yet. However, if it brings a peace of mind, or an order to the chaos, or an explanation that seems to have merit, I feel I can't just sweep it under the rug.
Of course Illuminatus! is fiction - but it definitely seems to draw from a lot of symbolism and esoteric ideas, and maybe that is what made me feel so drawn to Schrodinger's Cat in particular.
I'm not sure I can completely agree with your complete disbelief in the supernatural - but then, it seems your definition is more refined than what the rest of the new age and old age world, the esoteric, would have us believe. To you I think whatever magick is, or the supernatural, is simply natural - it's some kind of effect derived out of a harnessing of the unconscious, the subconscious, and maybe our interconnectedness with everything else. I guess I'd have to have your take on all of this at some point...actually, I'd quite enjoy it.
As a final note, it has been a long-time fear of mine that yes, maybe playing with the forces, or whatever THIS STUFF is (enlighten me?), may not have been the brightest idea...especially without any real guidance whatsoever. I'm glad you think I can make it through, although I wonder if I really can. I recall a friend of mine from Alaska talking about having an experience very similar to what I've been going through, the difference being she actually came across people who could help her understand and deal with it. Nobody I know really understands any of this...you being the sole individual now.
It's late...I'll try and respond to more tomorrow.
Reply part 6
Date: 2014-09-15 06:28 am (UTC)"That being said, how could it be that the lunatic asylums would be full of those people, if there was nothing out there? But that can't really be the case, can it."
Sure it can. You think all those "alien abductees" were really abducted by aliens? The Truth Is Out There, but so is a truly stunning amount of craziness - much of it benign, but not all. I know someone who believes in the 'Hollow Earth' theory - isn't that quaint? I know someone who believes that crop circles are made by aliens, despite the guys who started the hoax having confessed years ago. I know someone who believes, among other things, that the Philadelphia Experiment really happened. One of my grade-school teachers believed in Mothman and the Jersey Devil, and I know two otherwise-sensible adults who fear the chupacabra. There doesn't seem to be any upper limit on the bizarre stuff people will sincerely, unshakeably believe on the basis of zero evidence.
Tell you what; read The Body Has A Mind Of Its Own some time, and then read Dion Fortune: it will be most edifying.
Illuminatus! is not only fiction; it's chock-full of inside jokes and 'kennings' that mean something quite different from what they seem. Robert Anton Wilson explained some of them in Cosmic Trigger, but there's a lot more in there. The basic premise of that book is "What if ALL the conspiracy theories were true?" Principia Discordia is a real book, sure, but so is Bored of the Rings. In all honesty, between Castaneda and Illuminatus!, more pure hokum was added to the Western Esoteric Tradition's 'New Age sewage' than we'd seen since Anton Szandor LeVey. Oh yeah, and Herman Slater's Necronomicon; can't forget that.
See, here's the thing: all that stuff is just fluff and woo. It sells well, especially to the post-adolescent market; it's shiny and entertaining and generally harmless enough, but nobody serious takes it seriously.
Reply part 7
Date: 2014-09-15 06:28 am (UTC)That puts it quite well! Everything we perceive and everything we can do is natural. The reasons why we sometimes perceive things that seem to contradict what we know of nature are within us, not 'out there'.
Aleister Crowley gets a lot of disrespect in some quarters (and too much awe in others) but he was the first to try to evaluate the practices of magick through the criteria of scientific experiment. (The scientific equipment is a whole lot better now, so we could have some amazing experiments if only there was funding for it.) He defined magick as "the Art and Science of causing Change to occur in accordance with Will", which is a really broad definition and doesn't say anything about the mechanisms of causality. (Admittedly, he did write a whole book to explain exactly what he meant by that.)
" maybe playing with the forces, or whatever THIS STUFF is (enlighten me?), may not have been the brightest idea...especially without any real guidance whatsoever."
THIS STUFF is the sekrit forces of yer own brain, young Jedi - that wondrous, mysterious, organic computer you carry around on top of your neck, that contains more neural connections than there are stars in the Universe. It can do things you can scarcely imagine; it can also self-destruct in some horribly creative ways.
As I see it, the main problem you've got with THAT STUFF right now is that you've still got the habit of attaching to Beliefs about it. Irrational, superstitious beliefs are the ones to mostly watch out for - that little whisper out of childhood that says "but what if there really ARE demons?", or 'counsels of despair' like "life isn't worth living if it can't be eternal" or "there's no point being good if God isn't keeping score". But even beliefs based on rationality can mess you up.
For example: Maslow's Hierarchy. It's a useful tool, a framework for thinking about human needs in relation to each other. One an use it as a tool without believing in it - without thinking that Maslow had come up with the ultimate, inerrant map of How Needs Work. Like Monty Python said, "It's only a model."
Same with the chakras, right? The chakras don't actually exist within your physical body. They're a conceptual tool, which can effectively be used to alter your physical body - you don't have to believe in their literal existence in order to use them.
You're getting a little guidance; not a whole lot, because I'm thousands of miles away and can't take responsibility for guiding someone I can't see. Initiatory training is a whole other thing; all I'm doing here is providing some information resources and a little reassurance. You aren't going to run afoul of any spooks that don't belong to you - it's your brain, no one else's, so if it sends you spooks, you just send them right back with a 'cancel order' sticker; don't put up with that sort of nonsense.
Scary but erroneous beliefs to smack down with a shovel if they emerge include:
~ that anybody but you (human or otherwise)can read your thoughts, control your thoughts, or control your body.
~ that it is possible to contravene the ordinary laws of matter and physics (gravity, inertia, conservation of matter and energy, etc.)
~ that there are alternate dimensions, planes or Universes you could travel to or through, or that other beings could emerge from.
~ that there are beings or creatures that can pass for human, but really aren't.
... the reason to smack these particular notions down is because they're the pernicious sort - the sort that really do lead to the lunatic asylum in many cases. If you ever find such thoughts becoming persistent or alarming, it will be time to seek professional counseling before things get worse.
However, I doubt any such thing will happen. I think your Dark Night will run its course and you'll be a lot less prone to that sort of thing.
Continued...
Date: 2014-09-14 07:39 am (UTC)Science doesn't want you to believe anything. Even the proponents of the scientific method don't want you to believe anything - they (we) want you to use your critical thinking skills to think about what you observe without forming "beliefs". The problem with beliefs is that it's all too easy to take them for essential components of one's identity. Then when they're shown to be in error, one feels one's identity to be threatened or compromised.
Yes, your beliefs about what magick is were erroneous. That doesn't mean magick doesn't exist; it just means you don't know what it is. This is good, because now you know you don't know what it is, which you did not know before.
No, there is no Supernatural. If your definitions of God or of Spirituality depended on the existence of the Supernatural, then it's got to be pretty disappointing to have to give those definitions up. However, those definitions are not the only possible definitions.
Yes, we are ephemeral biological organisms living on a small ephemeral planet, and our species will be lucky if it lasts another thousand years. What of it? Knowing this doesn't change anything in the real world. Heaven was never true, and it's still not true. The Space Brothers were never coming, and they're still not coming. Life was never like we were taught in Sunday School, and it's still not.
So? Do we stop putting up the Yule Tree because Santa Claus isn't coming to leave presents under it? No, we put it up, and then we put the presents under it, because we are the grown-ups now. Do we stop treating other people decently because the social contract evolved naturally out of human needs, rather than being presented on stone tablets by a burning bush? I don't know about you, but laws and prisons are not the reason I don't kill, steal, or drive 100 mph.
"The worst that could befall you is that you could be homeless, eating out of a shelter, sleeping on wooden planks with a single blanket. Or you could get murdered."
Um, no. Not by a long shot. That's not even the worst that can befall a young, able-bodied person. But so what? Yeah, the world is a lot worse for a very great many people than it is for you: do you intend to do anything about that? If not, why bring it up?
"I haven't learned a thing."
Sure you have:
~ You've learned that this path is a whole lot harder than you thought it would be, and that your determination to walk it may not be as firm as you once thought.
~ You've learned that your maladaptive cognitive schemas have deep roots, so weeding them out once doesn't suffice; they'll come back twice as strong if you don't keep weeding.
~ You've learned that a cursory glance through the principles of critical thinking doesn't mean you grok them well enough to use them effectively when you need them.
~ You've learned that knowing a belief is irrational doesn't mean you can just let it go like a balloon, la la, after having held it all your life.
~ You've learned the power of the Dark Side - the 'Addictive Voice' of negative self-talk, of which you're currently having an extinction burst.
~ You've learned how much work you have to do, and how much you wish there was an easier way.
*hugs* It's okay, young Jedi; all of this is part of the path - the sucky part, I admit; sometimes poetically called the Dark Night of the Soul, where one stumbles about cursing and tripping over things. It doesn't happen just once, either; it's a recurring feature.
(Still too long; continued again)
Re: Continued...
Date: 2014-09-14 08:58 am (UTC)There was a similar description given in a Qabalah text that I have long lost. It talked about "correction", and it was actually very similar to what a psychologist might call bipolar disorder. The only way you move up degrees is by correcting, and the only way to correct is to experience these negative, or dark states, have your heart hardened - and then it is softened to a greater degree than it previously was. That was the gist of it anyway.
At any rate, it's completely draining the hell out of me. And I'm rather certain there's no getting off this train.
Reply part 8
Date: 2014-09-15 06:44 am (UTC)Be reassured by this, at least: other people have been through the same thing you're going through, have come out the other side of it, and have said that the gain was worth the pain.
Note that I think the Dark Night describes your psychological state pretty clearly, but your physiological state is something else again. You need a doctor who knows what he's doing to check you out properly and then refer you to the right specialist, so don't delay. It's perfectly possible to have a Dark Night of the Soul and myalgic encephalomyelitis at the same time.
No, there's no getting off the train, but hopefully you'll soon be able to move to a nicer carriage.
Re: Continued...
Date: 2014-09-14 08:21 pm (UTC)Everything you say rings true to me. I could probably go at length about any particular point...but I've already written a lot in response. I'm not sure you'll get around to reading them either - but at the moment I'll leave things as they are.
-hug-
Reply part 9
Date: 2014-09-15 07:06 am (UTC)What this path is, is your path. That's all; that's all it has to be. You can stand still, you can double back, you can blunder into the nasty bogs, but it's all still your path. Sometimes you'll be walking it singing; sometimes sobbing and swearing. Sometimes you'll have a destination to move toward; sometimes you'll just be exploring; sometimes you'll be lost as hell. Sometimes you'll be benighted in the middle of nowhere, and will have to crouch miserably in the dark until you've got enough light to stand up and move on.
The light and the dark are always going to alternate. The seasons of your heart and the weather of your mood are always going to shift. But love the journey, enjoy the adventure - even the really uncomfortable parts - because it is your journey; your path; the only thing you can ever truly own.
Hang in there; I'll hope to get back online tomorrow evening - hope your day goes well!
Continued again...
Date: 2014-09-14 07:40 am (UTC)"It's as if life played a cruel joke on me. I was lied to about the nature of humanity."
No more you, than any other human. The lie is that any human knows, or can ever know, "the nature of humanity". The nature of humanity is to be human, that's all - which necessarily comprises all human behaviors; constructive, destructive, pro-social, anti-social, everything. It's like, the nature of dogness is to be dogs, right? Squirrel-nature is fully expressed in everything squirrels do, and has no existence or meaning outside of that. Why would human nature be different?
Kurt Vonnegut said, "Maturity is a bitter disappointment for which no remedy exists, unless laughter could be said to remedy anything." As it happens, laughter can be truthfully said to remedy a lot of things. One of the things for which it's a fairly reliable cure is that feeling of humiliation when one realizes one's been sent on a snipe hunt. If it's any help, the people who sent you probably genuinely hoped you'd catch one.
"Treat others how you want to be treated...if only that really resulted in people treating you the way you treat them."
Well, there's a fallacy in that, isn't there? If you wanted to be treated with deference, going around deferring to others wouldn't induce them to treat you that way. Trusting someone untrustworthy won't make them either trustworthy or trusting. Further, "Do unto others as you would have them do unto you" never implied that those others would do the same.
Others treat you the way you teach them to treat you. If they're not treating you how you want, change your strategies. This could include not hanging out with people who treat you poorly, but it could also include cultivating a serene and cheerful attitude even when it's in conflict with your feelings. It could even include deciding not to date anyone until you have your life in order, whatever form that order might take.
Satan is a ludicrous explanation for anything at all, though belief in Satan has certainly caused its share of the horseshit on this planet.
The only way any of us can have a place where ideals are real is if we make them real. The only way to do that is to live by them whether or not anyone else does - not to get better treatment from others, not to get a crown in Heaven, but because that is the only way to make them real. If the horseshit on the planet troubles you, take arms against it; find some service that needs doing, and do it. This will help more than all the books on Enlightenment ever written.
*hugs* Hang in there!
Re: Continued again...
Date: 2014-09-14 08:15 pm (UTC)I'm not even sure I'm all that sophisticated. I'm more or less a stubbornly self-taught individual...and stubborn is probably the best term for me. I'm a lot like my father. I look up to him in so many ways, but as I've gotten older, I see his weaknesses too...and they are my weaknesses, as well. The difference is that he still produced a functional life out of it all...and I would never be truly happy in his shoes. I'm scared in a way that I will end up in them...especially working where I do.
I'm scared, I guess - scared that maybe I don't have it in me to meet the challenges life placed in front of me...and also that it's too late for some of them. It's like I'm being torn apart inside, between my ideals, and the reality. Once again that link about the dark night of the soul comes to mind...I really don't feel at home with "this" -waves his hands around himself- anymore. I don't feel at home with the way things were. I feel out of place, out of time. My dark night of the soul has been happening for a long time...sometimes I get glimpses of something better...but they are always short lived.
I have basically resigned myself to singleness until my life is in order. I can't possibly have someone else adding variables to an already incredibly complicated equation. They'd have to be one exceptional person to break through this suit of armor and these walls, anyway...I don't think I've quite had armor as extravagant as this in my entire life so far, and there was a time when I was much more aloof, dark and mysterious.
-hugs- I really mean it when I say thank you. I'm glad you let your thoughts and presence be known.
Reply part 1
Date: 2014-09-15 02:11 am (UTC)That's what all this is for, dearheart. Who'd want a doctor who'd never been sick a day in his life? The Wounded Healer doesn't stay wounded - the Wounded Healer first finds healing for him/herself, and then can honestly say "I got well; you can too."
*grins* Stubbornness is a good thing; thank your father some time for passing on that trait to you, because it's what will keep you going when all else fails. I know, because my father was a stubborn old Viking, and I'm a lot more like him than he wanted a daughter to be. (Heh, my life would have been entirely different if I'd been First Boy rather than Third Girl, but... I wasn't.) I suppose one of the reasons I like you so much is because we're much alike in certain ways, despite the major differences in our life-situations. You've got grit; you 'keep on keeping on' even when you don't even see the point, and that's what wins.
Few or none of us ever turn out to be the people we meant to become. That's the true, heart-breaking tragedy of the Human Condition: that we all start out as lovely babies, fresh and innocent, with the whole glittering Universe before us to explore, and we end.... all the ways we end, with most of our shining potential unfulfilled. The true, awe-inspiring glory of the Human Condition is that, knowing that, we keep on trying to fulfill it anyway.
(continued...)
Reply part 2
Date: 2014-09-15 02:13 am (UTC)One problem I see you're having is that your little town is at least a generation behind the times, so the young folk there must ALL be totally confused by the differences between Home and The World. I can relate; my town is the same - "God's waiting room"; old people run everything, and young people run away to Seattle if they can, because there's no opportunity here. The ones who stay are mostly in the same boat as you: their jobs aren't great but they're too good to just abandon for nothing, and they can't just abandon their aging parents either, even if they don't live with them.
I don't think taking two or three college courses per year online would be a "rash decision'. That's what my daughter's doing - basically because I insist that she finish out her degree, but I don't care how long it takes her, and her life is too busy for more than one class per semester, even online. You can certainly afford one class per semester online - the college you went to before probably offers online courses; if not, can direct you - so I say, go for it; I think it would do you a lot of good to be back in college, in a lot of ways.
You're still young and malleable enough, and I strongly advise you to remain malleable as long as you possibly can, in All The Ways. Sheesh, I'm constantly telling people in their 50's and 60's that they are not too old to change their lives, and here you are in your 20's, thinking you've got to be stuck in your ruts forever because you're no longer a boy? No, hon, the dismay you're feeling - like Kurt Vonnegut said - is just a sign that you're a bona-fide adult now. When you're twice the age you are now, you'll still be only middle-aged.
Yeah, you're a country boy, and that is a good thing. I went to a lot of trouble to bring up a country girl, because the country is the best place for children. You had big aspirations, yeah - so do most kids, and most kids turn out to be fairly ordinary people, but that doesn't mean they "failed miserably". What it means is that youthful aspirations are usually unrealistic - hence a lot of the disappointments of maturity. It's okay to be an ordinary person: that's not failure, that's just reality.
I am a very talented musician. I probably could have been a rich and famous musician if my path had gone that way, but it didn't - partly because I'm too stubborn to either take instruction or 'play the game', but also because I don't want to work that hard at it. I'm not 'hungry' enough; I'd just as soon play my music to the seals as to human folk - I take gigs when I'm asked, but I don't seek them out. So I have a very small following, and I wouldn't have any at all if nobody but the seals ever heard me. I see the lives of my friends who are professional musicians, and that life would definitely not suit me, so I'm okay with not having it.
I liked your music that you posted, even though it's not my genre. I think you could make a go at a musical profession if you could stand the life that goes along with that, but it's a hella stressful life - hard work, hard knocks, raving narcissists (show biz, right?) - and I think you might well hate it.
I'm also a very good teacher, and I could see you doing that - although in all honesty, I think you'd despise the hidden curriculum of compulsory education as much as I do, so teaching public school might not work out so well. There are a lot of other kinds of teaching besides public school, though. What would you want to teach, if job-availability was not an issue? What kind of place would you like to teach in?
Reply part 3
Date: 2014-09-15 02:14 am (UTC)Yeah, you're having a Dark Night, and it will probably go on for a while, because they do. I'm sorry; I know it really does suck, and there's nothing to do but endure it till it runs its course. But even if you weren't having that, you'd still be scared, because the whole world is scared now, and with good cause.
It's true, the 20th century was a hideous mess, and unless a lot of things change, the 21st could be a whole lot worse. Your generation is emerging into adulthood on the global firing line: either you'll change the course of civilization, or it'll crash and burn, and the Four Horsemen of Logical Consequences will re-balance the population in their own special way. Anybody who's not scared hasn't been paying attention.
So: courage. If everything is irreparably doomed, then it's doomed, but suppose it's not? Suppose the hard times ahead (and yeah, they're coming) are survivable; that with enough effort we could pull through? Who's going to help pull? If we're doomed anyway, we might as well die with our boots on, eh?
What it comes down to is, heroes and sheep. The heroes are going to fight till they win or die, because that's what heroes do. The sheep are going to mill around bleating, stampede at every threat, and follow whoever feeds them, because that's what sheep do. Human nature is both heroic and sheepish, so most of us will probably do some of both.
So what's all this extravagant armor for, then? It's true, you're too old for goth angst now - playing 'Dark Darkness of the Dark' after a certain age starts to look more pathetic than mysterious - but why the walls? Who do you think is going to attack you, that you'd need all these elaborate defenses?
It doesn't make any sense to say "I'm doomed and wretched for lack of love and affection, but it would take an exceptional person to break through my armor and walls." Nobody with a lick of sense is going to try to break through your armor, hon; if you want to experience the warmth of human contact, you're going to have to take all that junk off, and venture outside those walls as a real, vulnerable person.
So what are you doing these days, besides working, pumping iron, and reading the gurus of the Psychedelic Age? Tell you what, Ram Dass (formerly Professor Richard Alpert) is a lot sounder than his old colleague Tim Leary, and has some very useful things to say about self-transformation.
(More coming; I just realized I didn't see your first reply.)
Reply part 4
Date: 2014-09-15 04:24 am (UTC)The idealistic perception you had of yourself when you were younger was the perception of a child, hon; that's all. Children are supposed to have idealistic, optimistic perceptions of themselves and of the world; it's a terrible thing when that is taken from them. Adulthood means having the strength to face the truth: that we're not special, that the world is as cruel as it is beautiful, and that we're going to die here.
You're certainly not one of the worst people on the planet! Sheesh, are you kidding? Do you think the worst people on the planet ever spend one single second wondering whether they're too judgmental, or not active enough in expressing the compassion they feel inside? I can't help but think your experience of real evil must be slight or none (and that's a good thing) if you think you're anywhere close to that league. Believe me, evil people do not worry about being evil.
Yes, you're an introvert, and that's okay. You may also be an Aspie, and that's okay too. (Those are both book links, by the way.) Your parents are probably fairly shy, reserved people too, and thus weren't able to help you that much with learning to be social. That's not their fault, but it does mean you'll have to teach yourself if you wish to learn.
With the music: have you considered taking a course in music theory? That would be the knowledge you lack - and just like with the principles of critical thinking, it's not enough to just read a book about it; you need instruction in how to apply the knowledge when you're having a problem. The best tool-kit in the world is useless if you don't learn how to use the tools, or if you don't use them after you have learned. Learning music theory will give you the diagnostic tools to figure out how to make better music.
Same with writing. If you don't know how to improve your writing, you can take a course or join a writer's group, and other people will gladly give you suggestions.
I surmise you have the same problems with classes that I do: either you're the best in the class, so you don't learn all that much, or you're not the best, and have to fight with your pride about that. The solution I've found is to whup my foolish pride from the very outset by signing up for stuff where I don't have a snowflake's chance in Hell of being the best, because I'm hopelessly outclassed. Then I don't have to worry about 'failure', because just keeping up at all is 'success', and if I do better than that, it's gravy.
Reply part 5
Date: 2014-09-15 04:25 am (UTC)Everybody truly fears rejection, hon - everybody except true psychopaths, at least. Defensiveness comes off as pre-emptive rejection - like that classic Far Side cartoon, How Nature Says 'Do Not Touch', right? Don't be that guy; he's never gonna get a decent date.
Rejection hurts, for sure. It hurts most when it's by someone you care about, but even rejection by someone you think is a total jerk still stings, and getting stung is never fun, especially when you're highly sensitive. It's going to happen sometimes, though, so the only rational course of action is to de-sensitize yourself: another fun process to work on for the rest of your days.
'The world' wouldn't miss any of us. The world is seven billion people busy with their own lives, and not much concerned with those outside their personal circle. Your personal circle sure would miss you terribly if you were gone - why, your mother and father would be devastated; they'd never in their lives get over it if they lost you. You have a sister too; you think she wouldn't care if you just disappeared? Your friends, they sound like a pretty good lot; wouldn't they care? I'd care, and we've never even met in person. You matter more to the people who know you than you realize.
You don't get to be someone else, but you are becoming a different you, so you're both getting and not-getting your wish.
(On to answer your other comments I missed before...)
Re: Reply part 5
Date: 2014-09-16 02:54 am (UTC)Part I:
Yes. That's exactly what human life is all about - although I really did believe (and maybe I still cling to that a bit) that I've really got a shot at doing something with serious depth and longevity that extends well beyond my own death. But there's been a load of detours and road blocks on the way...that's no understatement.
Part II:
That's my town, yep - and I think in a lot of ways, it's the children who had /the worst upbringings imaginable/ who tend to get out...or the ones who came from very large or wealthy families. But that doesn't hold true in all cases either - it's more just a general feeling that I get. I could have gotten out, but there was a. no pressure (there were things that happened that I can point to that really make it seem like my parents...particularly my mother...DIDN'T want me to leave) b. I spent time chasing girls who were terrible for me and in deep contrast to my persona and c. I felt insecure and fear when it came to money issues and not having anyone to fall back on. I didn't want to end up homeless and I felt that...given the way the world had treated me so far besides my family...that there was a good chance I could get a very shitty hand dealt anywhere else. And honestly - when I went to Alaska - I did. The only job I was offered with certainty was at a fish hatchery with low wages and well away from the artistic, compassionate culture of Cordova. Every other job I tried to get was handed to people with more prior experience or "better social personas." Granted I was still young, had basically zero references and only an A.A. in the Liberal Arts...but it was still a shitty hand in my mind.
I'm glad you liked my music - I feel it is still far too ridiculously simplistic (and yes, there is a market for that in electronica but it just -isn't- what I'm trying to express.) It never is. I want to live and breathe and understand the puzzle language of music so much because it's like my HEART has to have it to survive. It's so frustrating to my heart whenever I can't fully express the idea...it's not a lack of creativity, and I have studied music theory although never from a "good book" (I don't know any)...things just haven't come together appropriately yet, I guess. Sometimes I am close...but it's still far too simple. There are others who enjoy it - but nobody would be willing to pay for it.
Yes, maybe I could make a run at show business...but I'm not sure my current fragile self could handle it. With my current schedule, which is 40+ hour work weeks, I basically need all the time left for recuperation and introspection...and that downright sucks sometimes. But I am an intellectual and introvert at heart...it's just the way it is.
I'd like to hear your music sometime, by the way. I don't know if you've ever recorded it or put it online, but if you haven't yet, you probably should. It's very likely a form of immortality that we haven't quite come to recognize fully yet as a people.
I'm still here!
Date: 2014-09-23 02:07 pm (UTC)You don't have to put on a monkey suit for those people, either. It's not a job interview, after all - what are they gonna do, disqualify you for wearing jeans? Wear what you'd wear to go out for coffee with someone; fancier than that is not called for.
" I've really got a shot at doing something with serious depth and longevity that extends well beyond my own death."
Of course you do. I would think that's one reason why teaching attracts you - like Christa McAuliff said, "I touch the future: I teach." Consider: we never know which of the sparks we pass on may someday kindle to a great light. It may be I've already done the thing of serious depth and longevity, and never even knew I did it, nor ever will know.
There ya go, young Jedi; there's the secret of magick: it's like the Butterfly Effect, right? "Change one thing, and everything changes". Thirty seconds of random kindness may save a life. One idea I put in the mind of a random preschooler thirty years ago may save our planet - I can't know. LOL, and for my Bardic renown, I think the songs I made for my preschoolers will out-last my sonnets. It doesn't matter; I do what I do.
Ack, just five minutes more online; I'll try to get back again sooner. The only music of mine online is Naergon an Kharas - cobbled together out of four wav. files I sang into my computer back in '98, so it's pretty terrible quality. (The music's embedded in that page, but if it won't play, it's
http://bwr.hyperchat.com/newchat/u/jessadrieldarkmountain/~bwr/Naergon_an_Kharas.mp3 )
Heh, want to talk 'detours and roadblocks', here's the homepage I made ten years ago, and I've still neither published nor recorded anything. Guess I'd best get it in gear, eh? ;~D
Ack, must fly; later! *hugs*
Re: Reply part 5
Date: 2014-09-16 02:54 am (UTC)The extravagant armor has slowly grown itself over the years. It started when I was quite young - I took a lot of damage and had to deal somehow. I've been trying some regression self therapy stuff (I think I actually did this without knowledge of it when I was on mushrooms and acid) and it might be doing some good - but I'm still not really sure how to break it apart. You're right - I'm too old to be an angsty goth...but it has left the imprint on me.
I have heard of Ram Dass, yes - and I have listened to some of his seminars - but I will look him up again at your mention because he did have a positive impact on my mind state. Lately I've not been doing much else besides what you mentioned - and I've settled with doing lower body workouts exclusively because my energy levels and tenacity has just been shot lately (the three week shutdown really put me through the wringer.) I have to house/dog sit for my aunt and uncle starting friday for over a week - that will be an extreme change of pace and I won't have my computer at all, which is fine - I'll take my acoustic guitar and hopefully find a pdf music theory/guitar book to bring with me on the tablet. I plan on reading a lot and focusing on music. It will probably be one of the better weeks I've had...and it will get me prepared to move out...which I would really like to do after winter...even though I'll miss my parents. I need to take responsibility for myself at this point...and if I do someday return to physical college, I don't want it to be me leaving a place of dependency. I haven't been hanging with friends at all...but, I haven't had any days off for three weeks, either. This past weekend I had off...and spent it trying to recuperate.
I'm going to stop here - I will go through the rest and try to respond tomorrow...of course, you may have responded to this by then. Rest assured I've read them all and let them sink in already.
-hugs- Happy Monday and Tuesday to you